PRI's The World » 11/24/2009

Entire program – November 24, 2009

The World — Tue, 24 Nov 2009 21:33:06 +0000

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Today on The World: Afghanistan’s security forces and whether they’ll be ready to deal with extremist violence when US troops eventually leave; Also, presidential elections are about to take place in Honduras — even though the country has yet to solve its ongoing presidential crisis; Plus a cover band from Istanbul reinvents Western pop classics — with a Turkish twist.

Building up the Afghan forces

The World — Tue, 24 Nov 2009 21:32:10 +0000

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President Obama says he would announce the long-awaited decision on sending more troops to Afghanistan “shortly”. Afghan President Karzai recently said the strength of Afghan security forces had to be bolstered and the role of international forces reduced. The World’s Katy Clark reports on how capable the Afghan forces are.

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MARCO WERMAN: I’m Marco Werman and this is The World. President Obama said today he’ll announce a new US strategy for Afghanistan soon.

BARACK OBAMA: After eight years, some of those years in which we did not have I think either the resources or the strategy to get the job done; it is my intention to finish the job.

WERMAN: The president was speaking at a joint appearance with India’s prime minister at the White House. Mr. Obama is expected to lay out his strategy a week from today. That strategy may include additional US trainers to help prepare Afghanistan’s own forces. The World’s Katy Clark reports.

KATY CLARK: President Obama says it’s important to recognize that the Afghan people are ultimately responsible for their own security. To that end the US and its allies have been working to develop a capable Afghan police force and Afghan national army. Results though have been mixed. The Afghan police remain largely a corrupt and ineffective force. But recent polls suggest the Afghan national army as one of the most respected institutions in Afghanistan. Doug Beattie would agree with that. He’s a former British army captain who writes about mentoring Afghan security forces in his book, An Ordinary Soldier; An Extraordinary War.

DOUG BEATTIE: One of the noblest, bravest men who I ever served beside in a 27-year military career was an Afghan police major called Major Shawally. He fought beside me in 2006. He saved my life on a number of occasions. And I mean that in real terms. He held me down while bombs were exploding above my head or close by and said to me, look I don’t want you to fight for me. I want to fight. I want you to help.

CLARK: Independent journalist Ann Jones came away with a much different impression after observing the Afghan army in training this past summer.

ANN JONES: I knew a number of young men who went through the training repeatedly in order to get the money, the stipend that they were paid, and the gun and then they’d go home and come back and do it again under another name.

CLARK: With so much resting on whether Afghan security forces can stand up to the task such a broad spectrum of opinions about Afghan’s capabilities might seem troubling but Anthony Cordesman with the Center for Strategic and International Studies says it’s not surprising. He says those on the more critical end of that spectrum are ignoring the fact that building a national army is an extremely complex undertaking.

ANTHONY CORDESMAN: This is a force very much in development. The Afghan army has a number of quite effective elements. Most are still relatively small. They’re at the battalion level. But they are improving their headquarters and some of their joint planning and intelligence capabilities.

CLARK: Cordesman cautions patience when it comes to expecting too much too soon from the Afghan security forces. He says it will likely take several years before they get up to speed.

CORDESMAN: And that’s not the fault of the Afghans. It’s the fault of basically the US and its allies in taking more than half a decade to realize the insurgency was serious and then taking two more years to provide the trainers and resources to make these effective.

CHRISTOPHER RADIN: I think in the long run we will develop and army. The question really will be will it be good enough?

CLARK: Christopher Radin is a correspondent for the Long War Journal.

RADIN: It will develop to a certain level but it will never be the quality or effectiveness of the United States army. But I think it will be good enough to fight the fight that it needs to fight with the opposition that it’s currently facing in the Taliban.

CLARK: Radin comes to that conclusion based on dozens of reports he’s seen about firefights between the Afghan national army and the Taliban. He says that in the vast majority of those accounts the Afghan army won the engagement. But winning over a skeptical American public is another matter. If President Obama decides that more time and resources are what’s needed in Afghanistan he might want to highlight more of the success there in order to make the case that Afghanistan is still worth the effort. For The World this is Katy Clark.

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India’s Muslim community – part 2

The World — Tue, 24 Nov 2009 21:31:04 +0000

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India is on high alert this week for terrorist attacks, as the country marks the one- year anniversary of strikes that paralyzed Mumbai last year. Indian officials have warned about threats from both foreign and domestic militants. But as we heard in part one, Muslims in India have largely not been radicalized to a violent form of Islam. However that hasn’t stopped the police from targeting suspected homegrown terrorists. In the second part of her series, Miranda Kennedy reports on the growing alienation of Mumbai’s Muslims.

Hameedia Mosque in Mumbai

MARCO WERMAN: I’m Marco Werman. This is The World. India is on high alert this week. The country is marking the one year anniversary of the Mumbai terrorist attacks and officials have warned about new threats from both foreign and domestic militants. The concern about homegrown terrorists in India often focuses on Muslims. But as we reported yesterday Muslims in India have largely not been radicalized to a violent form of Islam. In the second of our stories about India’s Muslim minority Miranda Kennedy reports from Mumbai.

MIRANDA KENNEDY: The streets around Hameedia Masjid, one of Mumbai’s oldest mosques, are jammed with the usual tumult of Indian life. Streams of traffic maneuver around a cow lying nonchalantly in the road. Cows are sacred to most Hindus and even in this Muslim area they respect it. Maulana Daryabadi who preaches in the mosque says that’s because Hindus and Muslims have lived side by side here for at least a century.

MAULANA DARYBADI: [SPEAKING ARABIC]

TRANSLATOR: This is a country where one cannot work without the other. The Hindus and the Muslims always work together. They always need each other.

KENNEDY: Muslims may be geographically and culturally integrated into Indian society but the Mualana says that when it comes to how the authorities with them all is not equal.

DARYBADI: [SPEAKING ARABIC]

TRANSLATOR: Every time there’s a blast or anything happening wrong they come and round up Muslims. We have demanded from the government to look into the matter questioning them why.

KENNEDY: His congregation tells him stories of their sons being tortured in police custody or worse of those who’ve been encountered. That’s a verb you hear a lot in India. It refers to extrajudicial killings by the police. The government doesn’t deny that these killings happen. In fact several Mumbai police offers have been dubbed encounter specialists and publicly commended for their work. The Indian government denies that police ever target people from a particular religion or community.

SAYEEDA HAMEED: There’s a long history of deprivation which starts in 1857.

KENNEDY: Sayeeda Hameed, a cabinet minister who is herself a Muslim, sites that year because it was the first major Indian rebellion against British colonial forces. The British blamed Indian Muslims and worked to undermine their power. When India declared its independence in 1947 it was a secular democracy that promised equal rights to Muslims even though many chose to move to neighboring Pakistan. Yet she says the Muslim population in India has consistently been neglected.

HAMEED: They have fallen so far behind that it’s going to take a while before we bring them on par with other communities.

KENNEDY: A government report on the state of India’s Muslims found that there actually fewer schools and roads in Muslim dominated areas than in other parts of the country. Twenty five percent of Muslim children have either never gone to school or have dropped out. Because there’s no affirmative action policy for Muslims there are less gainfully employed than all other groups in India.

[HASHMI FILM SONG]

And it’s not just the poorest of the poor who experience discrimination. It’s found even here among the stars of Bollywood, India’s prolific and lighthearted film industry. In this film Jannat, the actor Emraan Hashmi, is the romantic hero courting the young heroin.

[HASHMI FILM SONG]

Hashmi has become a sought after name in the industry in the last couple of years. He can now charge about a million dollars a film. And the fact that his name clearly identifies him as Muslim has not been a problem for him. But outside the film studios actors like Hashmi sometimes find themselves treated like Muslims rather than stars. Recently Hashmi tried to by an apartment in a well-heeled neighborhood known as the Beverly Hills of Mumbai.

EMRAAN HASHMI: Because everyone knew that there are a couple of buildings that don’t know allow people from a section and we had heard that this building don’t allow Muslims.

KENNEDY: But Hashmi and his wife really liked the place so they found a broker who was willing to try to get it for them.

HASHMI: The reason why he said that you know I’ll try to get the deal through is because I’m an actor and maybe they will overlook the fact that I’m Muslim.

KENNEDY: Although they’d agreed to pay the asking price, $700,000 for a two bedroom, the couple was refused. The co-op insists it did not deny Hashmi the apartment because of his religion but he filed a compliant with the government minority commission and publicly accused them of discrimination. Since he went public with his complaint Hashmi has realized that no matter how rich and famous he is he shares a common bond with India’s impoverished Muslim community. He’s been shocked at how many people have told him similar stories about being denied housing because of their religion. The difference is that no one paid them any attention. For The World this is Miranda Kennedy, Mumbai.

WERMAN: Tomorrow we stay in Bollywood for the third in our series of stories from Mumbai. A look at how Muslims are portrayed in Indian films.

Honduras vote

The World — Tue, 24 Nov 2009 21:30:34 +0000

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Honduran President Manuel Zelaya (pictured) was ousted in a coup five months ago and it now seems unlikely that he’ll be returned to power before his term ends in January. On Sunday, Hondurans will go to the polls to elect Zelaya’s successor. Many Latin American countries are refusing to recognize the elections which are being organized by the de facto government of Roberto Micheletti. Yet some Hondurans consider choosing a new president the first step toward ending the country’s political crisis. From Tegucigalpa, John Otis reports.

MARCO WERMAN: I’m Marco Werman and this is The World, a co-production of the BBC World Service, PRI, and WGBH Boston. Honduras’ strange political saga comes to a head this weekend. That’s Hondurans elect a new president. Their last elected leader, Manuel Zelaya, was ousted five months ago but he remains in limbo at the Brazilian embassy there. Many Latin American countries are refusing to recognize the elections organized by the defacto government of Roberto Micheletti. Yet some Hondurans say this weekend’s election could be the first step towards ending the country’s political crisis. John Otis reports from the capital Tegucigalpa.

PORFIRIO LOBO: [SPEAKING SPANISH]

JOHN OTIS: During a televised debate presidential front runner, Porfirio Lobo, pledges to attack corruption and reduce poverty in Honduras. Lobo’s main challenger, Elvin Santos, offers a similar message in his campaign speeches.

ELVIN SANTOS: [SPEAKING SPANISH]

OTIS: But the issue neither candidate mentions is what to do about deposed president Manuel Zelaya, a leftist with close ties to Venezuela’s Hugo Chavez. Zelaya was removed from office by the Honduran military on June 28^th amid fears he would try to change the constitution to remain in power. He was flown into exile. But he later snuck back in to Honduras and now remains holed up in the heavily guarded Brazilian embassy. Last month US diplomats announced they had brokered a deal to reinstate Zelaya for the remainder of his term. But the agreement hinged on the approval of the Honduran congress and most legislatures opposed Zelaya. They were also busy campaigning for re-election and have postponed their decision on Zelaya’s fate until next month. Miguel Gutierres is Honduran newspaper publisher claims congress is simply trying to run out the clock.

MIGUEL GUTIERRES: This has been a delay and a delay and a delay. I don’t personally believe that they will reinstate Zelaya back. Meanwhile Roberto Micheletti, Honduras’ provisional president is pushing ahead with the elections.

ROBERTO MICHELETTI: [SPEAKING SPANISH]

OTIS: To appease the international community Micheletti last week announced he would assume a low profile and make no more public appearances until after the voting. Still the elections are going forward under a cloud of suspicion. The organization of American states has refused to send electoral observes to Honduras. Brazil, Argentina, and other Latin American nations say they will not recognize the results. One presidential hopeful and dozens of pro-Zelaya legislative candidates have withdrawn saying their participation would only legitimize the coup.

[PROTESTORS CHANTING]

Anti-government marches have been banned in the capital Tegucigalpa but everyday Zelaya supporters meet in front of congress. They’re calling on Hondurans to stay home on election day and protest. Juan Barahona is one of the main opposition leaders.

JUAN BARAHONA: [SPEAING SPANISH]

TRANSLATOR: This is a coup regime. One that’s illegal and illegitimate therefore the electoral is illegal and illegitimate.

OTIS: Micheletti as well as the two leading presidential candidates are betting that relatively clean elections will make people forget about Zelaya. Daniel O’Connor is an American business man and a member of the Democratic Civic Union, a group that strongly backs Micheletti.

DANIEL O’CONNOR: I think there’s a strong expectation that the elections will be free, fair, and transparent. That the results will be ultimately recognized.

OTIS: The US government has cut off military and other non-emergency aid to Honduras yet critics say Washington could have taken a tougher stance. Instead American diplomats have hinted they will recognize the elections whether or not Zelaya is reinstated and that may have stiffened the resolve of the Micheletti government. US Ambassador Hugo Llorens says there’s still time for Zelaya to return to the presidency. He insists voters have the right to go to the polls next week and the condemning the elections would be akin to blaming the entire Honduran population for the coup.

HUGO LLORENS: We’ve worked very hard. We’ll continue very hard to restore the democratic order. But certainly free, fair, and transparent elections will be a part of the solution in Honduras.

OTIS: The next president will be sworn in on January 27^th. On that day all eyes will be on the figure handing over the presidential sash to the new Honduran leader. Lisa Haugaard of the Washington-based Latin America Working Group says that if Micheletti rather than Zelaya presides over the ceremony it will send a dangerous message to the rest of the region.

LISA HAUGAARD: We have thought that coups were things of the past and it’s very disturbing that there can be a coup that is more or less successful.

OTIS: For The World I’m John Otis in Tegucigalpa, Honduras.

[MUSIC]

Dolapdere Big Gang

The World — Tue, 24 Nov 2009 21:29:01 +0000

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Cover bands aren’t usually musical innovators. But Dolapdere Big Gang of Turkey might be the exception. Most of the group lives in Dolapdere, an Istanbul neighborhood with a rough reputation. This eight-piece band of young Roma musicians, plays Western pop hits in a traditional Turkish style. Matthew Brunwasser has the Globzl Hit.

Dolapdere Big Gang
Video: Dolapdere Big Gang

Even though you’ve probably heard these songs about a zillion times before, Dolapdere makes them sound fresh.

Singer Emir Yeshil is Turkish, the only member of the group who is not Roma, or Gypsy. Most of the group lives in Dolapdere, an Istanbul neighborhood with a rough reputation.

YESHIL: Its also where the gypsy musicians live, they call it as a music factory. and the best musicians of turkey mostly come out from dolapdere.

The band got started about five years ago.

YESHIL: They first called it dolapdere big band, as in a jazz band, like big band, because there were like 10 people in the band, but then some newspaper wrote it wrong. they said dolapdere big gang.

The band liked the mistake, with its vague hint at Roma criminality. So they kept the name. Part of the band’s mission is to celebrate the musical traditions of Dolapdere and Turkey.

Here’s a Turkish-Roma twist to the 1986 rock epic by the Swedish band Europe. The final countdown.

YESHIL: Turkish traditional music is huge, there are 12 notes and one octave in normal western music, and in Turkish music, every half note has 9 different notes too, and there are maybe 500 scales in Turkish music, and we are trying to show the world.

YESHIL: “We do a lot of these things in our music, maybe in the beginning or the end, but it still comes to the point that you understand what turkish music is all about, no harmony, no nothing, just melodic instruments and percussion instruments. ”

Dolapdere uses traditional turkish instruments that you don’t hear much in pop music. The kanun is like a zither, played with picks. Then there’s the tambur, which looks like a long-necked lute. The band also has a clarinet and violin. Not your standard pop ensemble.

Emir Yeshil says a big difference between western and oriental music is the rhythm. Dolapdere likes to switch back and forth between western and Turkish rhythms in the same song… like this 9/8 rhythym. In the song sex bomb.

YESHIL: The rhythm makes you feel a little confused, when you first hear it, you can not clap to it, you can not understand where it starts, you have to listen to maybe 4 or 5 times and then you get the idea

Listeners are getting the idea. The group is playing for an increasingly diverse public these days, in western europe and the former soviet union, as well as here in Turkey. The bands third album is due out in March and Yeshil says there’ll be a bit more rock, drums and guitar. Whatever comes out of the new mix, Dolapdere clearly knows how to create chemistry between genres.

For the World, Im Matthew Brunwasser in Istanbul.

Canada’s stake in Afghanistan

The World — Tue, 24 Nov 2009 21:04:26 +0000

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President Obama’s decision on whether to deploy more US troops to Afghanistan will certainly affect the more than 2800 Canadian troops in Afghanistan right now. Anchor Marco Werman speaks with reporter Graeme Smith, who has covered the conflict for Canada’s Globe and Mail newspaper from a base in Kandahar.

MARCO WERMAN: Many US allies are anxious to hear what President Obama decides to do in Afghanistan. Today a top British defense official spoke about the pending announcement. Bob Ainsworth told parliament that the wait for a decision on General McChrystal’s request for more troops has hurt the UK’s efforts to build support for the war.

BOB AINSWORTH: We’ve suffered a lot of losses. We’ve had a period of hiatus while McChrystal’s plan and his requested uplift has been looked at into detail to which it has been looked at over a period of some months. And we’ve had the Afghan elections which have been far from perfect.

WERMAN: Canada is another country with much at stake in Afghanistan. There are some 2800 Canadian troops in the country now. Graeme Smith has long covered the conflict for Canada’s Globe and Mail newspaper from a base in Kandahar. He’s right now in Toronto. Now Peter Mackay, Canada’s defense minister is quoted as saying that Barack Obama’s hesitation in his decision about troops in Afghanistan was not helpful because everyone has hit the pause button until the US decision. What has this long decision making process meant Graeme Smith for Canada’s commitment to Afghanistan?

GRAEME SMITH: You know it’s politically convenient for Mackay to be saying that but in fact Canada hit the pause button a long time ago in Afghanistan. You know when Canada first sent a battle group into Kandahar in February 2006 it was a big deal. It doubled the number of international troops in the south. You know the Canadians were chasing Taliban all over the place – across about 50,000 square kilometers of territory. But the Canadian role has diminished significantly since then. Now with the arrival of a surge of US forces in Kandahar the Canadians are relegated to guard duty essentially protecting Kandahar city and its populated approaches. They’re operating in a much, much smaller box. Maybe roughly 100 square kilometers and they’re doing their best to hunker down and let the Americans do the heavy lifting at this point.

WERMAN: I mean Barack Obama raises the specter of 9/11 often when justifying the US presence in Afghanistan. But that was, let’s face it, nearly 10 years ago. It must really seem like ancient news to Canadians.

SMITH: Well you know Canadians were just as shocked as Americans were I think watching those towers fall. And in many ways our culture is heavily tied in to yours. So you know those scars are still there and that specter is still used as justification for the war. But Canadians are turning against the war. Right now as we speak there’s a huge kafuffle going on in Canada’s parliament over the treatment of detainees and whether or not Canada violated Geneva conventions by knowingly handing over detainees into torture in Afghan hands. And the whole mood of the country has shifted I think. Canada is no longer as enthusiastic about this war.

WERMAN: Are Canadian commanders looking for the door?

SMITH: You know they’d never say that to you in public but I’ve had a lot of conversations with Canadian military officials who just don’t think that this is a viable mission. You know they’re happy to do what they’re ordered to do and they will do it professionally but the aims that have been set out for this conflict just don’t match with the realities on the ground.

WERMAN: Do you think that means for Canadian commanders that they don’t think more American troops would make a difference?

SMITH: There’s a real split you know. At the senior levels, the leadership of the military argues in public in favor of the kind of surge that McChrystal’s describing. And in fact there are people who say that you need much more than the surge that McChrystal’s describing by classic sort of counterinsurgency terms and just frankly looking at the mess on the ground in Kandahar it’s obvious that many, many more troops would be needed if you were going to actually do this. But privately I think people have a lot of concerns about whether or not this is actually possible with 40,000 or 60,000 or however many troops you put in.

WERMAN: And Graeme what is this chatter of pullback actually mean to the Canadian public? I mean they’ve been told for a long time of the importance of the effort in Afghanistan.

SMITH: Canadians were told they were going to help little girls get into school. They were going to help the United Nations you know reach into the districts and improve the lives of ordinary people. And you know [INDISCERNIBLE] those things have not happened. In fact, since the Canadians arrived in force in the south in early 2006 the United Nations own maps show that their access to the rural areas has diminished greatly and Canadians have endured just a barrage of bad news from the battle field. So I think that as a whole Canadians are tired of the war and ready to let the Americans take over.

WERMAN: Graeme Smith who’s covered the conflict in Afghanistan for Canada’s Globe and Mail newspaper from a base in Kandahar. He joined us from Toronto. Thank you very much indeed.

SMITH: Thank you.

Chess returns to Afghanistan

The World — Tue, 24 Nov 2009 21:03:02 +0000

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Playing chess was not allowed under the Taliban but last weekend, a coffee shop in Kandahar was the site of chess tournament. Local Kandahar journalist Rahim Akrami reports.

MARCO WERMAN: The Afghan city of Kandahar was considered a Taliban stronghold before 2001. Even today it’s an unlikely place for someone to defy a Taliban edict. But that’s exactly what took place when a coffee shop in Kandahar staged a chess tournament last weekend. Rahim Akrami is a local journalist who’s been following the moves. He’s also the son of the director of Kandahar’s Chess Federation. Akrami says that under the Taliban very few Afghans played chess.

RAHIM AKRAMI: It was a forbidden activity back in the Taliban regime so it was a bit undermined during that regime. But the recent tournament that we had in Kandahar played a vital role in promoting the game and expanding it.

WERMAN: I’m wondering during the Taliban regime when chess was forbidden did clients come into the Kandahar and play chess in a locked room where nobody could find them?

AKRAMI: No actually at that time there was no coffee shop. It was built after the Taliban regime fell down. But at that time I remember since my dad is playing chess for a long time, he and his friends would go to one of their friend’s houses and then play in one of the rooms, preferably a basement because that way they could play it secretly because at that time it was a forbidden activity.

WERMAN: And Rahim tell me why you play chess. What do you like about the game?

AKRAMI: Well one of the first reasons was that I was very much inspired by my father who is now the Chess Federation director for Kandahar. But second of all I was playing other sports but now I am a part of this tournament and then since I was … . I was actually [INDISCERNIBLE] and I was not taking part in it but now I’m getting more into the game and I think it’s [INDISCERNIBLE]. The other reason is just to follow in my dad’s steps.

WERMAN: And who is the current chess champion Rahim?

AKRAMI: Well in this tournament that just past his name is Abdul Wasay. He won the tournament. But there are other people that are also very good players. There’s an old guy who was refereeing the game too. He’s also a good player and also my dad. He’s a member of the National Chess team.

WERMAN: I’m glad you represented your dad in that statement. I’m sure he’d be glad to hear that. Rahim I’m curious what would happen if an American GI from like one of the local bases there came into the Kandahar coffee shop to play a round of chess. What would happen?

AKRAMI: He would probably keep attention of the people. Nothing big would happen if [INDISCERNIBLE] but without security I don’t think any American or any other foreign national would want to be in a coffee shop. That’s how I look at it. I mean it may different. They might want to come here. But again it’s a question of the situation and security.

WERMAN: Well Rahim very good to speak with you.

AKRAMI: Thank you.

WERMAN: Rahim Akrami is a journalist in Kandahar. He was a spectator at Kandahar’s chess tournament.

Nepalese festival angers animal rights groups

The World — Tue, 24 Nov 2009 21:01:54 +0000

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Animal rights activists are up in arms over a traditional Hindu ritual taking place in a small Nepalese village today. Part of a festival honoring the Hindu goddess of power, the ritual involves the slaughter of thousands of animals. Anchor Marco Werman finds out more from the BBC’s Joanna Jolly.

MARCO WERMAN: Many Hindus cross the border from India to be in Nepal today. As many as a million worshipers traveled to a small Nepalese village for a big festival. It honors the Hindu goddess of power and as part of the festival thousands of animals are slaughtered and that’s drawn the ire of animal rights activists. The BBC’s Joanna Jolly is back in Katmandu after spending the day in Bariyapur where the ritual took place. Joanna explains what the slaughter is all about. I mean you’ve got a million Hindus coming to this. Describe the scene.

JOANNA JOLLY: Well it’s extremely crowded as you can imagine with a million people. There are many of whom who’ve come over the border from India and are sleeping rough outside in the fields around this tiny little village in Southern Nepal. And many of them have brought their own animals. And today was the day 10,000 buffalos were sacrificed by 250 men who’d been specially appointed to do it. And this happened with big machete knives. And mostly the buffalos were decapitated in one blow. But this is very much part of Gadhimai Festival which only happens every once every five years and is seen as a chance to say thanks for any good luck that you have and also to ask for good fortune from the goddess Gadhimai, a Hindu goddess of power.

WERMAN: And so you’ve got 10,000 buffalo being killed simultaneously by 250 men. That’s some pretty serious carnage. How long does it take?

JOLLY: Well it can take hours actually. It took several hours this morning. There is some skill in decapitating the buffalos and they do die instantly but those that aren’t killed immediately run around the filed and it’s quite distressing.

WERMAN: Why do people come to this? I mean they’re coming from many, many miles away – hundreds even thousands of miles away. Is it the festivities? Is it a religious thing for them?

JOLLY: Well it’s certainly a very festive event. I mean when I was wondering around last night at midnight it was absolutely crammed full of families who were buying sweets from stores, presents for each other. There were 14 tellers. There was a Ferris wheel even. It’s quite a happy event. It’s like a big village fair and I can see the attraction in going. It looks like a lot of fun. But more than that I think animal slaughter is very much a part of life here in Nepal and appeasing goddesses is very much part of the Hinduism that’s practiced here. Some people … . In fact we met some people today who were taking their buffalo along to the slaughter but couldn’t afford to have their buffalo slaughtered so their buffalo was just having his ear chopped off which was considered a symbolic small slaughter in order to bring good luck and fortune.

WERMAN: A lot of people have criticized this ritual. When you say the phrase in Nepal what does that mean to people there?

JOLLY: Well there is an animal rights group here. It tends to be made up of the sort of rich members of society here and has a lot of support internationally from people like Bridgette Bardot, the French actress, who’s written to the president to try and stop the Gadhimai Festival going ahead.

WERMAN: So when the Nepalese received this letter from Bridgette Bardot how did he react to that?

JOLLY: I’ve heard of no official response to the letter to be honest. And the day before the Gadhimai Festival started animal rights activists had a symbolic protest sacrificing coconuts just to say look here you don’t have to kill an animal in order to please a goddess. But many people feel that you do. That this is what the goddess wants. This is what the priest is asking for and this is the only way to ensure good fortune and good luck for their family.

WERMAN: I mean I have to ask you Joanna what did you feel when you witnessed this festival?

JOLLY: I went to see the enclosure of buffalos at night before they were slaughtered and I did feel pretty bad. I’m not a vegetarian but I did think gosh this is quite sad.

WERMAN: The BBC’s Joanna Jolly in Katmandu. Thank you so much for your time.

JOLLY: Thank you.

Famed Chinese translator dies

The World — Tue, 24 Nov 2009 21:00:27 +0000

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Anchor Marco Werman talks with Simon Winchester about the legacy of Chinese translator Yang Xianyi, who died in Beijing yesterday at the age of 94.

MARCO WERMAN: China’s official news agency today announced that Yang Xianyi has died at the age of 94. Yang Xianyi was a translator of literature. He brought some Western classics to life in Chinese. But he perhaps best known for his translation of Chinese classics into English. Writer Simon Winchester is mourning the loss of a great translator but also of a dear friend.

SIMON WINCHESTER: He was the most remarkably kind, courteous, scholarly, intellectual, old man I think I’ve ever known in China. I first met him about 20 years ago. At the time his wife was alive. She was an English woman, Gladys Taylor. He, Yang Xianyi, was educated at Oxford at Merton College Oxford where he read English. It was there that he met Gladys and the two of them moved back to China in the 1940s. They were dedicated communists and lived working for the Chinese People’s Publishing House translating both classic works of Chinese into English and English works like Pygmalion by Bernard Shaw into Chinese. And it became a sort of right of passage with any young foreign correspondent, as I was at the time, visiting Peiking or Beijing as it is now, to go and see Yang Xianyi and Gladys. And they lived in a modest apartment in the center of the city passionately in love with Chinese literature and they couldn’t have been more warm and welcoming and memorable people and I’m desperately sad that he’s died.

WERMAN: Were all the books that he translated novels?

WINCHESTER: I believe so yes. I mean he was doing the most amazing work. Even when at Oxford he was translating Chinese works into couplets in the style of John Dryden. And when he got back to China he looked at all that great classics, things like the Dream of the Red Chamber, where there was not a particularly sensational English translation. But he took on this task and if you go to any book seller today and buy The Dreams of the Great Chamber it’s almost 100% likely that his will be the translation because it was so beautiful and elegant and he had the metaphors and the vernacular of both languages off to a tee. And Gladys was equally good but he was really the giant among translators. But I believe nearly everything that he worked on was indeed as you say fiction and poetry.

WERMAN: And he also wrote some of his own poetry and in a BBC interview a few years ago he recalled how outspoken he was in some of his writing.

YANG XIANYI: I wrote some poems defending Khrushchev saying that his denouncing Stalin was very good. And party secretary copied it down. But at that time she was polite to me and didn’t accuse me of anything until the Cultural Revolution starts.

WERMAN: And Simon Winchester tell us how exactly did that end up by biting Yang Xianyi during the Cultural Revolution? I mean he was caught up in the turmoil of the Cultural Revolution.

WINCHESTER: He most certainly was and it ended tragically for all concerned. I mean they came in the middle of dinner I think. They first of all took him away leaving Gladys with their son who I think at the time was about 14 or 15. Then a week later they came and took her away and the poor little boy had no idea where his parents had gone. They just disappeared. So the little boy was then taken off to England for a while by a very well-known professor of art at Oxford and he was fostered but no one knew if the parents were still alive. Well this uncertainty deranged the poor child and he killed himself. I think he gassed himself as far as I recall. So this was an added burden for the family because of course they were eventually rehabilitated and the communist government apologized to them formally and then this diminished family remained in China and he didn’t waiver – neither of the two of them wavered – in their support of the communist government despite the awful things that had happened during the revolution. And the next time we heard from him publicly was at the time, 1989 June the 4^th, the Tiananmen Square incident, the massacre, when he went on the radio and was denouncing it in very, very strident terms. And then he was by then a fairly elderly man and he disappeared into a gentile retirement but nonetheless believing all the while that [INDISCERNIBLE] despite the [INDISCERNIBLE] was the right man for China.

WERMAN: Writer Simon Winchester, a friend of the late Yang Xianyi. Simon’s most recent book is The Man Who Loved China. Thank you very much.

WINCHESTER: Thank you so much Marco.

Geo Quiz

The World — Tue, 24 Nov 2009 20:59:22 +0000

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Our daily geography quiz.

Italy may lose its lunch

The World — Tue, 24 Nov 2009 20:58:22 +0000

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The World’s Alex Gallafent considers the institution of lunch in Italy.

MARCO WERMAN: Italians are up in arms today over a statement from a leading member of the government. Gianfranco Rotondi is Italy’s minister for program implementation and he suggested that lunch breaks are bad for the Italian economy. The World’s Alex Gallafent takes up the story.

ALEX GALLAFENT: It’s not that Rotondi is saying no lunch. He’s just saying don’t spend so long and don’t eat so much. One Italian trade union called that at attack on worker’s rights. Sergio Romano thinks that’s a bit over the top.

SERGIO ROMANO: Again as it often happens in Italian politics we are whipping the cream so to speak because there isn’t much to talk about.

GALLAFENT: Here’s what there is. Gianfranco Rotondi says that long lunch breaks are bad for output and also for the harmony of the day. But the basic premise of the comments doesn’t tally with the experience of Romano, a commentator for the newspaper Corriere della Sera.

ROMANO: It seems to be that the lunch break in most offices in most companies is very short indeed. Maybe he wanted to say that it should be more flexible in the sense that there should be more continuity with people leaving if at all possible at different times. But I have a feeling that lots of companies already do that.

GALLAFENT: What’s true and true not only Italy is that if you have a job your work environment and your schedule is going to have some kind of effect on your eating habits. Here’s Glorian Sorensen, a professor at Harvard School of Public Health.

GLORIAN SORENSEN: And clearly work breaks are a chance for workers to actually step back from the work environment, relax a little bit and hopefully by having a lunch break they’re actually able to eat healthier.

[BEEPING NOISE]

GALLAFENT: Oh there it is. Meal break. Back in a moment. Professor Sorensen if you have any more insights please be my guest.

[MUSIC]

SORENSEN: The Scandinavians have actually done a really good job with thinking a little bit about how we might be more effective in taking work breaks and thinking of that as a sort of a down time for workers. I think probably as Americans we’re not always sort of in the vanguard of how to effectively use work breaks.

[BEEPING NOISE]

GALLAFENT: What so soon? Alright back on the clock. Some news reports suggest that the target of the government minister’s comments may have been not just lunch breaks in general but the institution of the ‘tavola calda.’ That’s a kind of Italian workers canteen that tends to host long and heavy lunches. Again Sergio Romano.

ROMANO: Yes well tavola calda is a rather old fashion expression. I’m sure they still exist undoubtedly. But for example in the business quarter of Milan where I live the lunch problem is solved with the bars serving quick lunch. Lunch is very short as far as I can tell.

GALLAFENT: Do they serve alcohol at lunch?

ROMANO: Can you ask Italians to give that up? I don’t think you should. You couldn’t ask me for example.

GALLAFENT: Maybe that’s it. The Italian’s are protective of lunch because it’s a pleasure. The time taken over it isn’t the only important factor. And Glorian Sorensen at Harvard says there could even be a health benefit here.

SORENSEN: Maybe the atmosphere around eating might be a part of what contributes to the healthfulness of a Mediterranean diet. I don’t know. I don’t think anyone’s studied that.

GALLAFENT: One ticket to Italy and an academic grant please. For The World I’m Alex Gallafent.

Geo answer

The World — Tue, 24 Nov 2009 20:57:17 +0000

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The answer to today’s Geo Quiz is Chihuahua, the largest Mexican state and home to the Chihuahuan Desert and the Sierra Madre Mountains. Mariel Luiz Solis Terrazas sent us an audio postcard.

Google nugget

The World — Tue, 24 Nov 2009 20:40:51 +0000

Anchor Marco Werman tells us about Google’s new project involving Iraq’s National Museum in Baghdad.